Read this before depositing money at Wincake
1. My Story as a Wincake cheated client :
I have been playing poker for around 12 months at Cake poker in 2011 and 2012.
At that time, it used to be possible to cash out with reasonnable delays.
For some reasons, I didn't use this account between september of 2012 and september of 2013. I have let the money in the account during this period.
When I came back in september 2013, the software downloaded an update and I realized I was now playing on the WinCake poker room. Not Cake Poker anymore.
So I learnt that the Cake Poker network had been sold to Lock Poker, and the Cake Poker pokerroom was now renamed and called Win Cake. The Cake poker network is now called Revolution Gaming Network.
After a few weeks playing in september 2013, I sent a withdrawal request of $10K on the 27th of september.
3 weeks after the request, the withdrawal was still pending.
So I contacted WINCAKE's support, and they replied : "Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you."
WINCAKE support also added that this cash out process can take months ("faster than 3 months though" they wrote).
As you may only request up to $10K, you also need to know that if you want to withdraw more than $10K, you will need to wait the 1st $10K withdrawal to be processed before you are allowed to ask a 2nd withdrawal to be processed.
THIS MEANS THAT YOUR WITHDRAWAL MAY TAKE SEVERAL MONTHS TO BE PROCESSED FOR EACH SLICE OF $10K.
Example : for a $40K cash out, you may need to wait months for the 1st $10K cash out to be processed, and then months again for the second $10K cash out to be processed, etc... 4 times in a row !!!
Here is WINCAKE's explanation : "our processors can only send so many withdrawals at any given time. The volume of withdrawal requests can only be sent at the rate of our processor and not as fast as we would all like. When there are more withdrawals than our processor can send, it causes a backlog which causes delays."
This reply makes no sense, as they are used to deal many deposit transfers daily, so why couldn't they deal with the withdrawal requests?
THE ONLY EXPLANATION MIGHT BE THAT WINCAKE DON'T HAVE THE PLAYERS MONEY ANYMORE. WINCAKE BUSINESS REALLY LOOKS LIKE A PONZI SCHEME.
So far, I have no idea when I will get my funds back. THIS IS OBVIOUSLY NOT ACCEPTABLE IN TERMS OF RESPECT OF THE CLIENT.
Moreover, one must know that there are 2 separate fields of poker players, one for recreational players and one for good players : "Our software is now designed to stop the most advanced players playing with the more inexperienced and recreational players at cash ring games. Certain tables will not be available for recreational players that advanced players see and likewise, advanced players won't see some tables that less advanced players see."
What's also surprising is that whereas WINCAKE and LOCK POKER are supposed to be 2 different firms with no link, the words of WINCAKE support seem to be a copy/paste of the Lock Poker support words :
"Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you. We are hoping you won't be waiting much longer and we will email you as soon as the funds have been sent. I'm very sorry for the inconvenience caused. "
This exact quote can be found in both firms suports emails.
After 45 days, the withdrawal request is still pending,
2. What I found out later :
There are thousands of poker players in the same case.
A lot of Wincake + Lock poker + Revolution Gaming Network clients are also waiting for their withdrawal to be processed.
Some of them for more than 6 months!
Find more information here :
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/win-cake-poker-withdrawals-177699/index350.html
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/lock-poker-pending-cashouts-2-months-report-see-post-366-important-update-1359432/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/195/lock-poker/pending-lock-cashout-read-cataloging-cashouts-market-report-1340603/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/unofficial-lock-poker-all-withdrawals-thread-us-row-players-1359782/
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29/news-views-gossip/official-lock-poker-crisis-containment-thread-former-call-out-lock-pros-thread-1328161/
THIS REALLY LOOKS LIKE A PONZI SHEME WITH NO MONEY LEFT IN THE PLAYERS ACCOUNTS DOESN'T IT?
3. The copy of the emails between me and the Win Cake support :
From: "ME"
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 18:47:25 GMT
To:
Subject: can't log in
Hi,
I can't log into my account : it says I have to contact you (error 616).
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 8:51 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Please note that I made some modifications to your account and you can try to login again.
Please restart the software before you are trying to access your account again.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 18:59:25 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Hi Mark,
Thank you, I can log in now, but what kind of "modifications" have been made to my account? Why couldn't I log in?
Also, I have requested a withdrawal of $10K on the 27th of september, and it seems to be still pending : how long will it need to be done?
Another question by the way : a player playing on a NL600 table recently asked me to join him at a NL1000 table, but I can't see any table above NL600 in the lobby (although I have selected medium and high stakes) : do you have any information about that?
Thank you
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 9:02 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. That have been simple security modifications, nothing to be concerned about. You will not experience such an issue again.
Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you. We are hoping you won't be waiting much longer and we will email you as soon as the funds have been sent. I'm very sorry for the inconvenience caused.
The poker network has adopted fair play technology which hopes to provide a better poker experience for all players. Advanced players are becoming more and more knowledgeable and skilled at poker and it is becoming much harder for recreational players to keep up with these high levels. Our software is now designed to stop the most advanced players playing with the more inexperienced and recreational players at cash ring games.
Certain tables will not be available for recreational players that advanced players see and likewise, advanced players won't see some tables that less advanced players see.
We are always working to improve and adjust this system and the system is always taking your play into consideration when updating this.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 19:55:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you.
>> Why are there such delays? Is it due to WinCake only or to a partner? if so which partner? Is Lock poker involved? Does it mean that Wincake can't assume the withdrawals?
What is the average delay? 1 week / 1 month / 1 year?
Certain tables will not be available for recreational players that advanced players see and likewise, advanced players won't see some tables that less advanced players see.
>> I don't get it : am I considered a recreational player or an advanced player?
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 9:57 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email.
Quite simply, our processors can only send so many withdrawals at any given time. The volume of withdrawal requests can only be sent at the rate of our processor and not as fast as we would all like.
When there are more withdrawals than our processor can send, it causes a backlog which causes delays.
Improving withdrawal timeframes is a priority for us and we're hoping not to have such delays going forward.
You are currently listed under the recreational level.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 20:04:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Is Lock poker involved in this process? I have read that they had not paid their clients for more than 6 monthes ! So I chose to carry on playing on WinCake because I didn't want to experience the Lock Poker issues.
The "processors" you mention : are they the same as Lock Poker uses?
In the case of Wincake, what is the average delay more or less? 1 month / 3monthes / 6 monthes / 1 year?
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 10:16 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Lock Poker is a different Poker site under their own management. Apologies but there we refrain from confirming a general time frame, it is faster than 3 months though. As I said earlier you will be notified by email once this has been completed.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME ) >
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 20:24:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Well I am very surprised by a 3 months withdrawal delay, and very disappointed too as I had never experienced withdrawal problems with Cake.
I think this is not acceptable.
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Please note that I explicitly mentioned that the delay should be below 3 months, and again we refrain from confirming an ETA.
Once again you will be emailed as soon as this has been completed and we are working to have this delay fixed, so you will not experience such incidents in the future.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 14 Oct 2013 09:48:44 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Good morning,
I have requested a withdrawal of $10K on the 27th of september, and it seems to be still pending.
I sent you emails last week asking you to proceed to the withdrawal before the 14th of october 2013, i.e. today.
As this has not been done, I will start making this incident public on the many websites I own and the forums where I am a member.
By the way, please add another $8K to my original withdrawal request.
I am obliged to request this by email as your lobby doesn't allow me to make additional withdrawal requests because my first request is still pending.
Best regards,
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Win Cake Support
Date: Mon, Oct 14, 2013 at 11:56 AM
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
To: myaddress@gmail.com
Hello ,
Thank you for your email.
Apologies, we don't get any updates until your withdrawal has been sent. At that time we'll email you immediately. I'm very sorry for the inconvenience caused.
Unfortunately, we cannot edit a withdrawal amount and please note that the maximum withdrawal amount is $10,000.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Geri
Win Cake SupportFrom: "ME"
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 18:47:25 GMT
To:
Subject: can't log in
Hi,
I can't log into my account : it says I have to contact you (error 616).
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 8:51 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Please note that I made some modifications to your account and you can try to login again.
Please restart the software before you are trying to access your account again.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 18:59:25 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Hi Mark,
Thank you, I can log in now, but what kind of "modifications" have been made to my account? Why couldn't I log in?
Also, I have requested a withdrawal of $10K on the 27th of september, and it seems to be still pending : how long will it need to be done?
Another question by the way : a player playing on a NL600 table recently asked me to join him at a NL1000 table, but I can't see any table above NL600 in the lobby (although I have selected medium and high stakes) : do you have any information about that?
Thank you
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 9:02 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. That have been simple security modifications, nothing to be concerned about. You will not experience such an issue again.
Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you. We are hoping you won't be waiting much longer and we will email you as soon as the funds have been sent. I'm very sorry for the inconvenience caused.
The poker network has adopted fair play technology which hopes to provide a better poker experience for all players. Advanced players are becoming more and more knowledgeable and skilled at poker and it is becoming much harder for recreational players to keep up with these high levels. Our software is now designed to stop the most advanced players playing with the more inexperienced and recreational players at cash ring games.
Certain tables will not be available for recreational players that advanced players see and likewise, advanced players won't see some tables that less advanced players see.
We are always working to improve and adjust this system and the system is always taking your play into consideration when updating this.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 19:55:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Due to the current delays we are experiencing with cashouts, I'm afraid we cannot confirm a timeframe as we could not guarantee a timeframe and we do not wish to mislead you.
>> Why are there such delays? Is it due to WinCake only or to a partner? if so which partner? Is Lock poker involved? Does it mean that Wincake can't assume the withdrawals?
What is the average delay? 1 week / 1 month / 1 year?
Certain tables will not be available for recreational players that advanced players see and likewise, advanced players won't see some tables that less advanced players see.
>> I don't get it : am I considered a recreational player or an advanced player?
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 9:57 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email.
Quite simply, our processors can only send so many withdrawals at any given time. The volume of withdrawal requests can only be sent at the rate of our processor and not as fast as we would all like.
When there are more withdrawals than our processor can send, it causes a backlog which causes delays.
Improving withdrawal timeframes is a priority for us and we're hoping not to have such delays going forward.
You are currently listed under the recreational level.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 20:04:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Is Lock poker involved in this process? I have read that they had not paid their clients for more than 6 monthes ! So I chose to carry on playing on WinCake because I didn't want to experience the Lock Poker issues.
The "processors" you mention : are they the same as Lock Poker uses?
In the case of Wincake, what is the average delay more or less? 1 month / 3monthes / 6 monthes / 1 year?
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 10:16 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Lock Poker is a different Poker site under their own management. Apologies but there we refrain from confirming a general time frame, it is faster than 3 months though. As I said earlier you will be notified by email once this has been completed.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME ) >
Received: Mon, 07 Oct 2013 20:24:26 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Well I am very surprised by a 3 months withdrawal delay, and very disappointed too as I had never experienced withdrawal problems with Cake.
I think this is not acceptable.
On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Win Cake Support wrote:
Hello ,
Thank you for your email. Please note that I explicitly mentioned that the delay should be below 3 months, and again we refrain from confirming an ETA.
Once again you will be emailed as soon as this has been completed and we are working to have this delay fixed, so you will not experience such incidents in the future.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: ME
Received: Mon, 14 Oct 2013 09:48:44 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Good morning,
I have requested a withdrawal of $10K on the 27th of september, and it seems to be still pending.
I sent you emails last week asking you to proceed to the withdrawal before the 14th of october 2013, i.e. today.
As this has not been done, I will start making this incident public on the many websites I own and the forums where I am a member.
By the way, please add another $8K to my original withdrawal request.
I am obliged to request this by email as your lobby doesn't allow me to make additional withdrawal requests because my first request is still pending.
Best regards,
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Win Cake Support
Date: Mon, Oct 14, 2013 at 11:56 AM
Subject: Re: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
To: myaddress@gmail.com
Hello ,
Thank you for your email.
Apologies, we don't get any updates until your withdrawal has been sent. At that time we'll email you immediately. I'm very sorry for the inconvenience caused.
Unfortunately, we cannot edit a withdrawal amount and please note that the maximum withdrawal amount is $10,000.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Geri
Win Cake Support
From: ME
Received: Mon, 11 Nov 2013 12:27:47 GMT
To: Win Cake Support
Subject: Fwd: can't log in [Ticket#: xxxx]
Good morning,
I have requested a withdrawal of $10K on the 27th of september, and it seems to be still pending 45 days later.
Why hasn't this withdrawal been done already?
Regards,
Win Cake Support
1:29 PM
to me :
Hello
Thank you for your email.
Our apologies for the delay with your cashout, I'm afraid we are behind our typical processing times at present but hope to be caught up shortly and have your cashout processed soon. We will email you as soon as your cashout has been sent.
Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.
Kind Regards,
Mark
WinCake Support.
